It's great to hear from you too! Moving to Japan 3 months before the pandemic made for an interesting 2-1/2 years. Not exactly the best time to make a new start. But we survived!

I live in a fairly remote area, not a big city like Tokyo, so not as much car activity. I'll post some stuff about the Japan car scene as I learn more.

By the way, I finally located some flexible tack strip (ply-grip/curve ease). Thanks for the kind offer!

Hi Fred. That's the first thing I thought about, but I can't find it here. Wish I'd brought some with me . . .

Actually, I realize that this post is not appropriate. If someone starts a conversation about furniture then everyone should be able to, and that wouldn't be right. Problem is, I can't figure out to delete it :confused:

Please let me try to help here. I've studied, taught and worked in the field of writing, and one thing I know is that clear writing requires focus and concentration. Unfortunately, smart phones, emoticons, and instant messaging apps like Twitter have completely destroyed our ability to concentrate. In fact, I'm sure that more than 50% of the people who started to read this reply are gone by now.

I think the point Fred is trying to make is that if you're really looking for help solving a problem, take a little time to focus on what it is you really want to know. Be very specific. For example, "I am working on a 1985 Toyota Supra, and I can't figure out how to remove the headrest." Send some photos with your article to help the reader see what you see.





Or, "A customer brought me some after market seat buns for a Jensen Interceptor, but the measurements are completely different. The contours are correct. Should I try to reshape the ones he brought in or scrap them and build my own?"





Auto upholstery requires a lot of patience and problem solving, which is one of the main reasons so few people do it. If you really want help solving a problem, help the people reading understand the problem. Doing this requires patience, but in the end, you will benefit and learn new skills that will help you solve immediate and future problems.

If you fire off a 20-30 word blurb because you're bored or in a hurry, that's fine . . . that's up to you, just don't expect good answers.

Finally, as for Fred any other reader trying to figure out what the hell these people are asking, that also requires patience. It's not worth raising your blood pressure over something that took 5 seconds to write. I realized when I was an English teacher that I probably put more time into trying to read, comprehend, and offer suggestions on a paper than the writer spent writing it. I'd say you're doing the right thing by asking someone to clarify.

Communication is a two-way process, both in writing and speaking. Until we come up with true telepathy, we're gonna have to keep working at it.

Nadeem's a writer, and one who spends more time at it these days than I do. Nadeem, you're younger than me, so you probably understand the Twitter generation better than I do. Please offer some suggestions that I left out.

Here's one of several options to create a flexible seat base without the old preformed or zigzag springs:
http://atrim.com/Page185.html

Geez! Jack, if you started trimming in 1945, that makes you at least 85 years old! Assuming you picked up tools at your dad's shop when you were 10 years old. I have seen guys work into their 80s, but this trade can take a toll on your hands, eyes, back, etc. Do you think you're just lucky, or can you offer some tips for trimmers to keep going as long as you have?

My hat's off to you, sir, for all those years in the trade. You've seen a lot of changes.

I've been a trimmer for close to 40 years, and I've seen a lot of shops close up. Unfortunately, there's not a lot of demand for our inventories once we do. I wish we had a better trade group and could do more to support fellow trimmers, but we've always been a pretty disconnected bunch compared to mechanics and body shops.

The only place I've heard of people having any luck is through SMS. We all know SMS' reputation, but if it comes down to a choice between donating it or throwing it all away, it might be better to get a few hundred dollars from a scavenger. I wish I had better news, and I hope you find a better option. If you have time to look up some of the bigger trim shops - especially in So. Cal, the Midwest, the South - places where car culture is big, you might find a buyer, but it's a lot of phone time, and chances seem pretty slim based on historical precedence.

This might help visualize the technique. Look closely at this tutorial from Brent Parker. However, for the back seam, sew the French seams FIRST, then sew the closing seam to finish.

http://www.thehogring.com/2019/09/13/brent-parker-french-seam/

There was (maybe still is) a line of after-market body cloth called Lion. Keyston Bros used to carry it, and I think most auto upholstery suppliers should know about. You might have to ask someone who's been around for 20 years or so. They had a very similar, if not spot on pattern just like that.

On the west coast of the US, Veteran Co. in Los Angeles.

If it's not available as original, some guys will take the time to make it. Get some thin, hardened wire (peel the paper off paper wrapped wire if you have to) and weave it every 1-1/2" or so. Tell your customer how much it's going to cost him, and he might not think he wants it so badly.

Fred Mattson can pitch in on this. He takes the time to painstakingly reproduce obsolete parts. He can tell you how he proposes it to customers.

There is a similar product used in commercial furniture manufacturing. I've seen it used as spring cover on restaurant booths. The wire is embedded in the material every inch or so, but the material is not burlap. It's a synthetic material like Typar. I've tried searching for it with no luck, but somebody is making it for commercial seating makers.

Oops! I forgot that part, Fred ;-)

That reminds me of something else we've talked about that would be good to share. Even though we've both installed thousands of headliners, we both ask ourselves when we finish each job, "How could I have done that better?"

Oh - Natalie, I think you can see that there is more than one way to do a suspended headliner in an early Mustang. As for the replacement board type, that's your call. Some trimmers will do whatever the customer wants, others take a more authoritative approach and say they won't because it's not the right way. TMI obviously thinks it's OK, and they've done Mustang stuff almost as long as they've done VW stuff. I've never installed one of those, but I've used other 'alternate' headliner concepts from suppliers and was never really satisfied with the results.

Have to agree with Steve on this one. I spent the first part of my career in So Cal, and part of that in the Mojave Desert where temps regularly reach 120 in the summer. I too have installed well over 1,000 headliners in just about every kind of car. If it was designed to be wrapped around the pinch weld (Mustangs/Bugs), that's how I do it. All suspended headliners that are designed to be retained otherwise have a lock channel, barbs or both - with a few other strange designs thrown in - mostly by Germans. In extreme conditions, I don't really on chemical bonds, only mechanical bonds.

You and I have talked about this before, Fred, and your method works for you. You've told me the reasons you avoid window gaskets over your headliner, and they are plausible reasons. You've also ribbed me for not going to the great lengths that you do to restore something as it was originally designed, right? Bending edgewire to replace springs instead of replacing them with zigzag sound familiar? I've heard you say, "There are ten ways to do something, but only one of them is right." I do not question your expertise in the least. You are without a doubt at the top tier of skill in this trade. I'm just saying that I'm only comfortable doing Mustangs and Bugs by removing the glass because I've seen the same thing Steve has seen.

I think it is West Trading, and I'm guessing that's one of the places you tried. If so, definitely try to get in touch with Jens. He's good with the German cars. http://www.naehkraft.de/

Perserverance pays off. That's one of an auto trimmer's most unique assets - patience!

There's a place in the Netherlands that has a good selection, but I'm away from the shop and can't remember the name. If Jens Jesberg doesn't chime in soon, send him a PM. I'm sure he knows some good sources.

When I have a project on that scale, I search for "commercial sewing contractors" in my area. Get a quote from a couple of them, then figure that into your estimate.

With Jens being from Europe where they developed this foam, he knows these headliners well. I do the same thing - if it's a waterproof or water-resistant board (fiberglass, polystyrene), then I use water in the difficult spots. If you immediately blow the area clean with compressed air, you can reduce any bloating that might occur if there's a surface layer of paper. For the really nasty goo, I'll spray 90% isopropyl alcohol and again, blow dry it quickly afterward.

In cases where I could get it smooth but couldn't eliminate the stickiness, coat the board with a PVA-based primer (most drywall primers). Then you'll have a clean, dry surface to glue to.

By the way, Michael Todd, I looked at your company website. I love it! Lots of American auto upholstery history going on there.

Sold

We started using a company that actually makes them - no middleman. Lifetime warranty too. https://seatcomfortsystems.com

These replies bring up a lot of issues that I would really like to talk about in greater detail. I am working on a reply that will address them in a way that a twitter-like reply cannot.

One thing I do want to say is that labor unions, certifications, and trade associations are very different things. Andy's reply says, "It all seems too close to a union type of situation." Honestly, I'm not sure why you think that, Andy. You didn't explain other than to say. " It's just how I think."

You also mentioned that certification was abused in a couple of companies you worked for. The only place that certification was mentioned in my original post was when I copied the section of ASA's website "What ASA Means to the Service Professional." It says, "Upon completion of course requirements, you receive the certification of Accredited Automotive Manager." It just means that you've finished all the courses.

I know my original post is very long, and people have trouble processing more than a few sentences at at time these days, but if you are seriously interested in finding new ways to grow your business, please take some time and read the first post carefully and think about whether or not you could benefit from a trade association. The benefits of a good trade association is for people who are seriously interested in finding new ways to grow/improve your business through networking and training, as Fred said before.

The only other supplier of NOS material aside from SMS that I know of is Original Auto Interiors in Michigan.

Hang on . . . another long reply coming soon