• Jim Nishida-Adams
    18
    Although there are many different kinds of auto upholstery shops, we share a deep knowledge of auto interiors that mechanics and body shops do not. One topic I always enjoy talking to other trim shop owners is: Why is the auto upholstery industry so far behind in consumer awareness, industry standardization, and training/education vs. automotive mechanics and auto body/collision?

    Think of all the training programs out there for the other guys. Think of all the thriving trade associations, industry magazines, and TV shows that educate consumers about how to interact with these shops.

    Let's do some brainstorming on this. What do you think about the mysterious auto upholstery industry? Have we somehow failed to keep up? Is there something about our trade that makes us mysterious our have we done it to ourselves?
  • Nadeem Muaddi
    84
    I think there are a lot of reasons why auto upholstery isn't as prominent as other automotive sectors. Just off the top of my head...

    1. It's a craft that takes years to learn and master. So, naturally, the industry will grow at a slow pace.

    2. There aren't many institutions in place to train and educate new trimmers. Most learn on their own or are born into families that already do it.

    3. Not a lot of shops can afford to pay apprentices what they need to make ends meet.

    4. Most auto upholstery shops are family businesses, not franchises of a larger corporation. So it's difficult (and expensive) to devote time and energy to anything industry wide. Shops are far too busy working to keep food on the table.

    5. There's no industry association advocating on behalf of independent upholstery shops. The few associations available to us (i.e. SEMA Pro), we don't join or participate in meaningful numbers.

    6. Upholstery isn't as vital to a car's operation as its body or mechanics. So car owners, especially those on a budget, can go long stretches without repairing their interiors.

    The situation is getting better. Now, more than ever before, people are realizing the importance of quality interiors and appreciating their fit and finish. A lot of money is being invested into their materials, design and craftsmanship. This is evident from automakers to everyday builders, and everyone in between.

    If there ever was a time to focus on growing the industry, it's now. But more trimmers need to step up to the plate.
  • Jim Nishida-Adams
    18
    In other words 1) fewer and fewer people have the patience to master a trade, 2) there are few opportunities to learn the trade, 3) who wants to spend years training a low pay profession? 4) same as number 2, 5) SEMA Pro kinda relates to what we do, but not enough to make it valuable to people, and 6) people have no trouble spending thousands of dollars a year on avocado toast, fancy lattes and alcohol, but would rather let their car interiors rot before spending a few hundred bucks to maintain them.

    Sad, but mostly true.

    One counterargument I can offer is the restyling industry. The one that SEMA is really the trade association for. The restyling industry has done a much better job of following the traditional business models taught by the SBA and most MBA programs. They have much better representation on journals, trade associations, and supply sources. What they don't have is the heavy skill set requirements that we have.

    Perhaps if we were able to improve our training systems, we would be able to grow, How many times have you heard another shop owner say "If I only had skilled, reliable people working for me, I could grow this business twenty fold. It's true, there is plenty of work out there, and a good sales/marketing approach could keep the work coming. The hardest part is finding the right people to do the work. I've paid experienced trimmers $20 and more per hour to start. That's a decent pay rate for many people.
  • Nadeem Muaddi
    84
    You're spot on that SEMA caters more to restyling than upholstery, but that's likely a result of its membership. If upholsterers joined in greater numbers, the organization would naturally change to reflect our interests. Wouldn't it?

    Another option is to launch an industry association of our own, similar to UTIC, the association that most of our suppliers and manufacturers belong to. It's not impossible, but it requires someone with organizing or union experience to take the reins.

    That said, I don't know that having an association solves the issue of our craft being "mysterious," as you say. Does it?
  • Fred Mattson
    152
    Networking and training are key elements to a successful industry. SEMA just hasn't figured how important the upholstery industry is yet.
    It is almost impossible to find and keep an auto trim apprentice. The dedication it takes to learn this trade makes it tough for most people to want a career and not just a job. Training for this industry involves a lot more than uTube can offer and most people are just not willing to pay for any knowledge.

    This will be a hard nut to crack, but I believe that it will bust open soon. count me in Jim!
  • Dan Fitch Jr
    2
    So if we had an association to belong to , what would you want in an association. I'd like to look into setting something up like this. But I'd need slot of input and I'd have to have some help but I'd be willing to get something started. What would be a fair cost of the membership . What would you want out of it example discounts , give me some ideas. I know I'm new to trimming but sometimes a fresh set of eyes can make a difference . Just let me know what you all think .
  • Jim Nishida-Adams
    18
    Since this thread went from one about why auto upholstery seems so different from other service industries to a conversation about the benefits of a trade association, I started a new discussion specifically about that. Please have a look:

    Trade Association for the Auto Interior/Upholstery Industry
  • Eugene Braswell
    1
    As someone who has only been doing upholstery for about 2 years, I found it incredibly hard to find any decent tutorials on the process. Of course I bought and read the book by Don Taylor and Ron Magnus, and another on the basics of upholstery, but compared to other industries, there is a great lack of information for someone wanting to get into the business. There are no trim shops close to me so I had no one to learn from. In my opinion it does seem thee is a tremendous secrecy to methods and practices in the upholstery business. Honestly if I had not found this site, and the great beginners section, when I was just starting, I probably would have given up, and it's not like I don't have some skills, I built a complete car when I was 20, and learned paint and body, metal fab, electrical, all of it by reading and doing. I've now been building cars for almost 30 years and get plenty of word of mouth business. I'm no pro at this yet, but with great people like on this forum and some help, and hopefully more tutorials, I'm going to try to get better. Just my .02
  • JB Bowling
    0
    I think you're partially correct on the secrecy thing. There were a lot of old timer guys out there that wouldnt want to help you out at all. Mostly because they didn't want to train you and then you turn around and take a bite out of their business. thats definitely how it was where i was from and I've heard others say the same thing. on the plus side, those old timer guys are pretty much retiring or sticking to just the bread and butter jobs. with sources such as this forum, and social media like instagram, theres a vast amount of trimmers out there that will tell you a lot of stuff to help. now they won't give away their deepest darkest secrets and tricks unless your dedicated to working for them, and understandably so. but they will help you out and give you the tips and tricks that you can use to become a better trimmer. and then from there you can start to experiment and try your own new things. ALSO.... sids dvds on upholstery, will immediately take your work to the next level. so if you haven't ordered a set of those yet, i suggest you do.
  • Randall Moore
    0
    Personally I appreciate it. Not necessarily the secrecy or mysteriousness of it but just the fact that it is a widely ignored trade. Mainly because that brings a serious respect with a customer into the shop that say a body guy or mechanic doesn't get. It makes the customer much more open to our suggestions and observations which In turn makes our job easier and more enjoyable.
    Realistically we are artists not tradesman. And you can't really teach that. It is passed down in the family (like I) or the person getting into it has a serious enough passion to take the steps to become involved. I really like the industry, there is not much I would like to change.
  • Nadeem Muaddi
    84
    There's definitely a fear in the industry that if you train someone, that person will eventually leave your shop and start a competing one down the street. It's not an unfounded fear, as I've heard some pretty unfortunate stories of it happening.

    That said, shop owners can prevent this from happening by requiring apprentices to sign a no-compete agreement, that legally forbids them from opening a competing shop within XX miles of their shop. If you really like your employee and want him/her to stay long term, you can also offer incentives -- like bonuses, vacation or even a small share in the business or profits.
  • Kevin Kinsey
    6
    I think the main reason the trade is so mysterious is because of the fact that not enough of us are willing to teach the trade. I recognized this at the onset of my career and vowed to do my part to help the next generation of artisans.

    I seized that opportunity by landing an auto upholstery instructor position at a community college and I will say this about it. It was a blast and I highly recommend that more trimmers look into programs to either expand, build or create courses to offer the youth! I only resigned due to a relocation but I can promise you I'm not done yet and will continue to push that envelope even further once I get my new business fully established. (restart)

    That all said, I have also of course trained many apprentices the "old skool" way in a shop environment and although it is certainly possible it is very difficult either way. My thought is simple, given a choice what shop owner (or any business owner ) would want to hire someone with literally no experience vs. hiring an individual with at least the BASIC CONCEPTS? (not to mention the interest shown...)
    Education is the key, both as basic entry level programs but ALSO as Higher Learning! Too many of us essentially refuse to support the training programs that DO exist (albeit not many) for new hires and absolutely refuse to support our employees who want and need more training. (shame)

    So if you like the mysticism associated with our industry, do nothing and it will continue.
    However, If you are like me and support our exposure for the benefits it will reap, then I say look in the mirror. Take a long look and then ask yourself what YOU can do as an individual to dedicate a small portion of your workweek to training! Those of us willing to take our industry into the new millennium will do well because something I think we are overlooking here is the company size. As a business owner i'll take a crew of 15-20 people cranking out cars over the typical traditional small shop that's lucky to have 5-10 people (usually less) ANYDAY OF THE WEEK. As both a trimmer and shop owner the math is still working in our favor if we can GROW!

    If we create a much larger pool of good trimmers, guess what??? all of the "good" shops will double and quadruple in size and the smaller traditional shops will become even smaller and more obscure. and again, everybody wins there. Most traditional guys like it that way and most guys like me just want to be able to grow into a larger scale business.

    If you made it this far, Thanks for taking the time!
  • Eldar Bechelov
    15
    Absolutely agree with your post. I keep thinking of that from the very start. Together with with my friend we gathered about 70 proffessionals chatting each day on whatsap. We share, laugh, offer and provide help. Buy and sell. Since lately i write reviews on sewing machines and theoretical articles. This is just a beginning. However, we dont have such good grounds to make things in Russia at present. Some things are extremely difficult some impossible for now.
    Absolutely sure, there should be multi-approach and complex measures taken, There should be a team and some money ofcource. Having that i am sure i would be able to change things. As a former marketing and business management professional with some knowledge in the craft i think i could organise things. I am sure Nadeem there are professionals out there in US that also could do all this. And the topic is really vital, as the craft may slowly dissapear in future or be taken at sole command of richest companies.
  • Al Decker
    22
    *Edit* After writing, then re-reading the following, I realized I got on a bit of a roll with my mumbled ramblings. Apologies for it's length.

    I've been in this trade for over 38 years now.
    Self-employed for the majority of that time.
    As a result, I've had to repair, design &/or fabricate many products outside of the Auto Upholstery realm. If I could get it into the machine, I'd sew it. Many of those projects I had never done before, or have since.
    Whatever it took to keep the lights on & the door open.
    People would ask the wrong questions.
    "Can you do this?"
    "Yes."
    Right answer to the wrong 'Q'.
    What they should be asking is..."Have you ever worked on one of these before?"
    "Well...no."
    And because of that, I've sewn some weird stuff! Production-line manufacturing to custom one-offs. From starting off with Taxi interiors, to managing a production hot tub cover facility, (100-120 covers a day. 16 staff) designing & producing interiors for customs, hot rods & restorations, including a Ridler Great-8 finalist, ('97) to lead-hand in a shop refurbishing & customizing interiors for Corporate Aircraft.
    I've always had that confidence that I could get the job done, and do it well enough that I would be proud to put my name on it in order to justify the end cost to the customer.
    If I wouldn't be happy with the project in my own vehicle, then why should my customer?
    Where did that confidence come from?
    I had great instructors! They instilled a great foundation of 'the basics', along with a sense of quality. "You'll do 1000 Volkswagen Beatles before you'll ever work on a Ferrari. But, produce on the VW as if it were a Ferrari, when it comes time to actually get to work on that $150,000.00+ machine, you'll have the chops already down. You're confidence in you're ability will get you through."
    30 some-odd years, I can still hear those guys, hanging over my shoulder as they walk me through a procedure that I'm now doing for the bazillionth time. Or some other one that I haven't done in 20 years.
    Over the time I've been doing upholstery, I've attained a certification as an A.M.E. Aircraft Mechanical Engineer. Multiple certs for various aircraft. Specifically Corporate Jets. A great job in an amazing environment. A good crew. Tons of advancement opportunities. "...and you're paying me how much?" A dream job!
    Then...9/11.
    Like a dog hitting the end of the chain in a full-tilt gallop. The work just stopped.
    Most of the U.S customers (Our bread & butter) had turned to in-country maintenance Co.'s as their primaries. Many cancelled contracts & appointments within days if not hours of that fateful date.
    So I went back to school.
    The goal? A Bachelor's Degree in Education.
    I had taken a 9 month pre-apprenticeship course when I began all this, way-back-when. The course was still being offered at the local college & the instructor was wanting to retire.
    You can see the direction I was wanting to go with this.
    2 months before I was to graduate & receive the degree, the college pulled the pin on the Automotive Upholstery/Trim Course. Auctioned the contents of the upholstery shop. Re-purposed the space.
    This was the only interior trim course offered in Western Canada. It may of been the only one of it's type in the whole of the country as I've never been aware of any other. Don't take my word on that, though.
    So...(& I said that a lot over the next few months! Lol!) I still needed to eat.
    Back into a one-man home-based shop once again! Working for a select clientele on their various higher-end HotRods & concours restorations. Many are repeats. The one in the shop now is project #7 for this customer.
    And I've been mentoring a few of the local 'rookies', too.
    Still, I feel somewhat frustrated. I have the knowledge. The background. Along with the formal education in order to pass that along in a concise manner.
    The local colleges have shown no interests. They know I'm here. I've made that abundantly known. Their definition of a trade consists of banging nails, hanging drywall, pulling wires, equipment operation etc. etc.
    They consider upholstery as an 'Artistic Endeavor'. As opposed to a builder of the economy.
    No matter how a vehicle is powered, people still need to sit in them. There will always be repairs required at some point over the vehicle's lifespan. Or customizing & personalization for those that wish. There are employers out there crying for suitable people with at least some basic training that can fill their immediate needs while also learning & advancing their skill set while on the job. (Which is were the education really begins.)
    Like I said. Frustrating.
    But there's still a few pokers in the fire. Ideas. Plans.
    Somebody's got to do this. I haven't given up yet.
  • Mike Mcphaden
    0
    I think you really have to look at how the upholstery industry has changed as a whole over the years. When I was a kid working for Pops, There was half a dozen shops in a 200,000 population city, each shop with 6 to 8 employees, that was in the 80's, as a 16 year old all I did was pickup and deliver cars to used and new car lots, Even in the late 90's and early 2000's I worked for one of the last multiple employee shops in the same but now 400 000 pop. city and we would work on 3 to 4 dealership cars a day. By the time I left in 2010 to go on my own we would get 1 or 2 a week. To the point of the question one of the local colleges had a evening course , you brought in an old footstool and recovered it once a week over an 8 week course and presto your an upholsterer! I guess that's mysterious? Over the years the guys that were 10 ,15 years older than me, as the industry changed and the money wasn't as good as it was, started there own little shops specializing in Boats Hotrods or whatever. but they were 1 or 2 person shops. you certainly couldn't count on the dealerships to support multiple employees like before . consequencely dealerships still have multiple mechanics and bodyshops have multiple employees .That gravy train has long since left the station. In my area there is lots of work for an upholsterer but you better be diversified, you certainly can't hang your hat on one part of the industry
  • Jack Purdue
    18


    That happened to me, both on the training side, ( trainee up and left after 2 years to open up in his garage) and as an employee. When I started about 40 some years ago,a competing shop down the road used to call my boss and ask to speak with me. He would then offer me at least $1.00 more an hour to come work for him. Remember that in the late 70's-early 80's, we only made $10 hour if you were good. My boss would get so mad at him for trying to steel me away, he would give me a raise right then and there and beat his offer. After about six months of this back and forth action, in the end the other shop won and I started there at over $15.00 hr. When I moved up to the rural town I live in now, I decided not to have employees and have run the shop on my own since the mid 80's. I'm now training my son to take over, (he's finally shown sincere interest in the business) and he will vastly out-do me with his younger generation thinking and restying ideas. As I'm now 65, I kind of look forward to retiring in a few years.
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